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Outdated Traditions and Sacred Cows

Think about the context of the team you are working in and the system of education you are a part of. What are the things that once made sense but no longer do?


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Trent Boyle
3 years ago

I find the amount of documentation we are required complete surrounding our teaching is excessive and unnecessary. I understand that there may need to be some process in place to ensure teachers are covering the required content at the required time, however the current form we are completing this in seems entirely outdated. I spend a large chunk of my time filling out documents that no one will ever look at. Time that would be better spent creating engaging lessons for my students.

Sarah H
3 years ago
Reply to  Trent Boyle

I agree Trent. This has been a change that has led to fatigue and burnout for teachers.

Alisha Whitfield
3 years ago
Reply to  Trent Boyle

I completely agree Trent. As a new teacher myself, it is definitely exhausting trying to cover all bases of the required documentation while finding and creating engaging resources and lessons.

Kathy
3 years ago

1. Teaching to a curriculum and having to tick all the boxes. There is no time for problem solving and critical thinking or creativity or problem solving.
2. Assessment – HSC exams – a 3 hr exam, can not possibly indicate what a student knows and understands, it does not allow them to express themselves and show the development of skills just what they my recall.

Trent Boyle
3 years ago
Reply to  Kathy

I also find the concept of 3 hour exams odd. Not only because of what you have stated about the ability of a 3 hour exam to accurately assess a students ability, but also the length of the exam itself. There are very few industries where people are required to concentrate under high cognitive load for 3 hours straight without a rest however this is the norm in most HSC exams.

Lanie
3 years ago
Reply to  Kathy

I feel the same constraints Kathy, especially curriculum requirements link to the HSC. Some subjects are so content ‘heavy’ that there is little time ti change and be creative.

Allison Alliston
3 years ago
Reply to  Kathy

Agreed Kathy…we become a slave to the “dot points”!!

Liz
3 years ago

One main factor I still don’t quite understand is the use of summative assessments. This confused throughout school and university training as in the real world, we have use of technology at all times to help us. people can often know the content of different concepts but not able to explain it through testing situations. I understand that the other forms of assessment contribute to this factor but I don’t believe there should always be a summative assessment to test a person/students ability.

Naomi
3 years ago

Some of our school’s outdated traditions and sacred cows in secondary education would be:
Standardised testing
Educating by age and not by ability/interest.
Separate subject areas when there are so many crossovers.
Fences around schools when so many students jump them anyway.
Primary has volunteers who come in to do one on one reading with students. Secondary doesn’t have this, yet it would be of value for so many students. Especially with limited funding that public education has. “It takes a community to raise a child”.

Sally
3 years ago
Reply to  Naomi

One-on-one reading with students who struggle is so beneficial yet lacking in so many high-schools. It’s benefits are proven, yet not enough emphasis is placed on it in a system where time is restrained and focused on primarily delivering the curriculum to tick boxes.

Joel
3 years ago

Some sacred cows of schools that might be considered to be outdated traditions include the use of bells and set timing for periods in high school due to it being the assumed best way to run a school. The compulsory nature of many subjects in Year 7-10 and the curriculum set externally are other possible sacred cows.

Imogen Allen
3 years ago

I feel that it can be confusing when you are encouraged to teach outside the box and focus on inquiry and STEM, when we are still conforming to many things in school e.g. bells, NAPLAN etc.

David Warburton
3 years ago
Reply to  Imogen Allen

Agree Imogen, also working through subjects while using STEM but breaking them into that subject’s time slot in the timetable. It’s like manipulating/squashing the new back into the old.

Felicity Bolwell
3 years ago
Reply to  Imogen Allen

I think we have the expectations of so many put on us and ultimately the Government dictate the key things we must cover particularly in the form of assessment and standardised tests. However STEM and visual learning are how students seem to learn through enjoyment and engagement. It’s a tricky one.

Warren Stanley
3 years ago

The idea of fixed timings and locations for learning. Responding to bells and dealing with classroom design that is outdated or inflexible We need to move away from the factory model of education towards a model that will cater for the 21st century worker who needs to be creative and imaginative to succeed..

Liz
3 years ago
Reply to  Warren Stanley

I have come across schools that don’t use bells anymore as they are seen as outdated, however without them students can’t follow routine and have set times for breaks etc. I am interested in how different forms of routine can be implemented into a day for students.

Tania
3 years ago

There are two things that I believe once made sense, however with the changing future, in my opinion, both the reporting system as well as assessments are the biggest sacred cow in today’s society.

The reporting system is something that is followed by all staff members, however strongly focuses on one comment for all KLA’s apart from English and Mathematics. These comments in my opinion are irrelevant as they do not accurately report on a child’s abilities, strengths as well as their development throughout the semester. We are required to provide a grade and effort, however is it more important to know a child’s grade rather than their progress and development? I believe not.

I believe that assessments once made sense but no longer do. In primary schools, students complete assessments on paper. Whereas in the real world, the importance is placed around technology and computers. Adding to this, some students aren’t as good at assessments as they prefer to answer questions in a different way rather than being under pressure.

Naomi
3 years ago
Reply to  Tania

Excellent point Tania, I didn’t think of that. The reporting system is definitely a sacred cow.

Pamela Paull
3 years ago
Reply to  Naomi

I agree Tanya. Students and parents expect that we still report on students’ work.

Liz
3 years ago
Reply to  Tania

I agree with the assessments points Tania. The students who have anxiety when it comes to testing and situations where they are expected to show their knowledge around different concepts can often deter a students from extending themselves.

Katherine.Hristofski
3 years ago
Reply to  Tania

I agree Tania, parents want to know a score and where their child ranks in the grade. rather the progress that is being made

Rae
3 years ago

Assessment for assessments sake is the greatest sacred cow in today’s classroom. More thought and consideration is required to ask exactly what information is required, how the data that is provided will be used and how can the information provided be utilised to effectively inform further teaching practice?

Naomi
3 years ago
Reply to  Rae

Gosh yes. Endless justification and evidence that you are doing your job, means so much valuable time in designing engaging and fresh programs is no longer available.

Lisa Simon
3 years ago

There are many sacred cows, but a couple that jump out are classroom structures and testing. Our classroom are limited by building structure, but what about how we set up the space withing those walls? Why does it have to be that way and not another? Testing of spelling words is a sacred cow that we are trying to move away from currently. Is there resistance? Yes, but it is changing.

Imogen Allen
3 years ago
Reply to  Lisa Simon

I agree that we are conforming to these things that may not be relevant to the child’s learning.

Pamela Paull
3 years ago
Reply to  Imogen Allen

I agree Lisa. Assessment and reporting to me are essential with keeping track of a students’ progress.

Scott
3 years ago
Reply to  Lisa Simon

I agree Lisa that we make changes for changes sake without knowing the consequences to a child learning.

Fiona Corcoran
3 years ago

Though of course vital, literacy and numeracy are still considered the main or “core” skills. Considering that jobs of the future will require people who are self-directed, resilient, creative and so much more, we need to be talking about these areas just as much as we discuss literacy and numeracy. We need to consider these skills as equally vital and not peripheral or the “other” or soft-skills. This is a massive shift. We also need to develop improved national assessment of students’ practical abilities through projects, demonstrations, performances etc. not just through tests/examinations. A student may not demonstrate strong skills in literacy or numeracy but may be highly capable in so many areas.

Barbara
3 years ago
Reply to  Fiona Corcoran

I totally agree Fiona. when designing patterns or recipes for practical work literacy and numeracy skill are applied and students become amazed when you actually apply the mathematical concept of Pi. They can actually understand where it may be useful. Inequitable time allocation to the subjects that are practically based subjects results in these subjects not being valued as the core traditional subjects(sacred cows.

belinda.butler
3 years ago

So many aspects of everyday schooling have become sacred cows…the way we organise learning spaces, the ways we measure and assess students( eg NAPLAN, standardised stage tests, the engagement in “busy” work requiring numerous worksheets, copying or assimilating information from the teacher “stage”. There is definitely a reflex of resistance that causes some teachers to desperately cling to these once efficient historical practices.

Tania
3 years ago
Reply to  belinda.butler

Great points there Belinda and I totally agree with you. The way we organise our assessments has become a sacred cow as we often put pressure on children to complete these assessments, however I believe it is an unfair way of deciding a child’s grade, effort, development and progress.

Sally
3 years ago
Reply to  belinda.butler

Yes Belinda. NAPLAN may have once been the way to compare data between schools. It has its benefits but the stress it causes, on top of students not participating or using this platform to show their true ability has made it less efficient and outdated.
The amount of photocopying that happens in schools is another sacred cow that need to be re-considered if we are to truly teach students to be mindful of the environment.

Katherine.Hristofski
3 years ago
Reply to  belinda.butler

Good points Belinda,
I agree assessments can be sacred cows

Mick
3 years ago

The two that spring to my mind are the traditional 8 period day and DEAR “Drop Everything and Read”

David Warburton
3 years ago
Reply to  Mick

Lol, whats the education system without a few good acronyms, DEARS, ‘Drop Everything And Read Silently’…

Nicole Richardson
3 years ago

I believe that many aspects of normal schooling are sacred cows. Bells, compartmentalised classrooms, separating students by age instead of development and ability, to name just a few. I imagine a school of the future with free flowing spaces with the option to learn in or outdoors, no bells, flexible scheduling, collaborative learning, and formative or project based assessment.

Lisa Simon
3 years ago

So many areas to consider, Nicole. It is interesting to imagine the future.

Rochelle Payton-Clark
3 years ago

There are a couple of things that come to mind; however, i think one of the biggest ones is the way that students are assessed. I have seen as a parent watching my child go through the HSC, the struggles he had articulating his answers into written form. If he was able to attempt the same questions verbally, the assessment of his knowledge would have been higher than anything written. As an educator, i also find that as soon as students hear or see the word test, they panic. There has to be a better way to assess learners, that can demonstrate their true potential, rather than a test that they may not even attempt.

Fiona Corcoran
3 years ago

This was my first thought too Rochelle. “Assessment” needs to be wider than NAPLAN and the HSC.

Mick
3 years ago

I agree

belinda.butler
3 years ago

Absolutely…we really need to re-think the way we assess our students, in ways that are real & meaningful for them & to not be pressured to “teach to tests” such as NAPLAN exclusively whilst temporarily discarding varied curriculum & deep learning. This is really a result of parental pressure combined with competing agendas!

Imogen Allen
3 years ago

I feel too that the way we assess students doesn’t often reflect their true capabilities.

Joel
3 years ago

Nice points Rochelle. Assessment definitely could be reinvigorated to ensure better learning outcomes of all students,

Tony Chamberlain
4 years ago

I think the old industrial revolution style education with bells etc is no longer as relevant. We need to start embracing technology and making learning more flexible and this goes down to how a classroom is set-up. More flipped classrooms and flexible collaborative working spaces at schools maybe.

Apii Nikoro
3 years ago

I’m all for embracing the involvement of technology in the classes but I see how there are barriers to the level of implementation. It would definitely transition out sacred cows such as the traditional classroom setting and the excessive amount of printing.

Jenny Nylund
4 years ago

The Teaching/Learning framework with the teacher as always the authority or expert in everything is outmoded. There are kids in the classroom more skilled in technology than the teacher may be, for example. The rigid nature of the role leaves little room for a flexible role.

The manner in which we assess student achievement no longer makes sense. Asking students to hand write very quickly in exams when the ‘real world’ uses computers and they may use laptops in the classroom but not be able to in a major exam is one prominent example.

Reporting systems which we follow that are a ‘one slze fits all’ model and don’t accurately report on individual strengths, creativity and development, but apply levels and grades which are less relevant than they may once have been ,

Tony Chamberlain
4 years ago
Reply to  Jenny Nylund

Yes I think the reliance on exams is a bit old hat now. I know a lot of students who”get it” int he classroom but are not good at writting down a large amount in a few hours. Sets them up for failure every time and they are not stupid students.

carol stapley
3 years ago

yes we need to move away from exams as they do not really help with learning they only test learning

Chris
4 years ago

Inflexible learning timeframes, focus on content delivery rather than mastering skills and gaining deep knowledge, single subject in a single period (lack of cross-curricular work). There seem to be many barriers (temporal, spatial, social) that the system perpetuates around student learning, while expecting things to start working differently.

Tony Chamberlain
4 years ago
Reply to  Chris

Yes. It seems that paridigm changes do not happen easily. Especially iin such a large organisation such as education. It would be good to see more small steps in the right direction. The most important thing is that we begin to evolve, but it doesn’t all have to happen overnight.

Kerrie
4 years ago

The way we lump students in age groups to learn. Ticking curriculum boxes and required to move through much irreverent content. State primary and high school assessment.

Rochelle Payton-Clark
3 years ago
Reply to  Kerrie

It can be hard for educators and learners to work with a scaffold lesson. A lot of subjects do have mixed learners in a class and this can often lead to some students slipping through the cracks. Having groups of students with similar abilities, would be nice for them to work at a pace they are comfortable together, through all subjects.

Mark
4 years ago

The factory production line model of schooling where kids are churned out in batches based on their age. We have students coming into stage 5 and 6 without the ability to read or write. Progression through an education system should not be based of a students age but rather their learning progression.

Kerrie
4 years ago
Reply to  Mark

totally agree Mark!

Rochelle Payton-Clark
3 years ago
Reply to  Mark

I am new to teaching, but i was wondering when mixed ability classes became the normal for schools? Is this a sacred cow? I remember being placed in classes based on our grades and ability. Since this only happens for particular subjects now, are some students missed throughout the rest of the subjects; therefore, leading to more students slipping through the cracks?

Mick
3 years ago
Reply to  Mark

I agree too

carol stapley
3 years ago
Reply to  Mark

yes 100% agree

Paul Crook
4 years ago

Teaching towards a sequential time frame to deliver content impacts on students deeper knowledge and understanding.Exploring content is thrust into the background due to time restraints .A whole system restructure would need to take place to improve learning.

Lisa Simon
3 years ago
Reply to  Paul Crook

It sounds like a huge and overwhelming task. Small steps can enact change though.

Chris Collier
4 years ago

The regimented system of how a classroom should function and the continued practice of ‘chalk and talk’. For generations of teaching, classrooms have stayed in the same format with the only progression being the ‘update’ from chalkboard > whiteboard > smartboard and giving off the false feeling of introducing new teaching and learning methods to the classroom. It is only recently that interactive, multipurpose and comfortable furniture, alternative work spaces and a push to leave the classroom to deliver lessons in the real world has come to engage a wider range of students.

Apii Nikoro
3 years ago
Reply to  Chris Collier

I agree Chris. There is definitely a need to ditch the old style of teaching to adopt a more interactive and technology involved environment. Just hope that schools such as those in the public sector can one day be as capable as others.

Beau Harper
4 years ago

The idea that chronological age defines student capabilities and that it also governs their transition into higher learning, apprenticeships and/or paid work. If we are to consider flexibility of concepts for learning, this concept should also be considered. Holding students back effects their motivation and level of engagement, as does pushing them forward if they are not ready. Of course there are social stigmas attached to this change and these will need to be considered. However, this is true of any change.

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Beau Harper

Yeah it’s tricky. Moving students on when they clearly are not capable of accessing further work is just a waste of ours and their time. Not being able to read/write/think makes higher levels of learning nearly impossible. Much better if they have the option of staying back a year or looking for alternate forms of work – apprenticeships etc. at a younger age.

Fiona Corcoran
3 years ago
Reply to  Beau Harper

Agree totally but assessing exactly where a students sits is a massive challenge, and where they sit for one subject may not be where they sit for others. Schools would need to be organised and would need to operate in a whole new way.

Joel
3 years ago
Reply to  Beau Harper

That’s very true Beau. Why is the age of students essential for how, when and who with students learn. The “real” world is beginning to change with age in employment and the differing ages for apprenticeships /traineeships that are now accepted.

Jade
4 years ago

There is way too much emphasis placed on ticking boxes. This often leads to rushing through course content to meet a certain reporting deadline. As a consequence, this makes it hard for us as teachers to create meaningful lessons that ensure that students grasp content/topics and have a deep understanding. When looking at preparing our students for the future, are we really doing so effectively while we are still using this “teach to the test” approach.

Chris Collier
4 years ago
Reply to  Jade

You have made a good point Jade. Reporting deadlines and teaching explicit content to meet student outcomes has pointed teaching and learning in one direction. I am optimistic that positive changes are happening and can see the future of teaching and learning embracing technology, the idea of student led choice, project based learning, as well as more emphasis on teaching skills (with content sitting in the background as supportive material).

Jenny Nylund
4 years ago
Reply to  Jade

Agree – the tick-a-box, prescriptive teaching framework can by-pass deep thinking, knowledge and understanding in the race to ‘get everything done”

belinda.butler
3 years ago
Reply to  Jade

A very good & sadly true point Jade. The criteria must be met, all the curriculum boxes ticked if we are deemed a successful teacher, leaving little time to explore, pause, reflect & to foster deep levels of engagement.

Tania
3 years ago
Reply to  Jade

You have made some great points there Jade and I couldn’t agree more with you. As teachers, we are provided with a large criteria to teach and are often rushed to ensure that we meet these standards prior to reports being due.

Richard Clement
4 years ago

I think that the depth of delivered detail pertaining to the curriculum has become unrealistic.

Kodi-Leigh Beattie
4 years ago

I believe the way that we assess students is no longer relevant, especially when it comes to the HSC. Is it equitable and fair to base all of that time and knowledge spent on learning a particular subject on one exam or long response?

The amount of time teachers have to cover copious amounts of content I believe is also become more and more unrealistic with the growing demands of students needs. Students are not able to gain a deep understanding of content because teachers are covering so much, in such a short amount of time. There seems to be no time to delve deeper into student interest or really engaging aspects of certain topics.

Chris
4 years ago

Agreed Kodi, not only this but universities seem to be concentrating less on the big number at the end of the HSC for entry into their institutions, and more on who the students are and what they’ve shown they can do. It will be great when the secondary system catches up with this. Education is no longer simply knowing, because anyone can find out with a flair of fingertips, it’s about what they can do with knowledge.

Jenny Nylund
4 years ago

I fully agree Kodi-Leigh. We end up with a ‘teaching to test’ style of teaching which focuses on rote learning and content-driven curriculum. Instead of fostering a sense of enquiry and desire to find out what, why, how etc, we see teachers rushing to complete a unit of work in a set timeframe so they can move to the next at the ‘right time’. The prescriptive approach does not encourage a growth mind set.

Jordan
4 years ago

The need to cover content and assessment time frames is not realistic. I feel that the students do not have enough time to develop a deeper understanding and knowledge of the content. We do not have enough time to allow students to explore their creativity and thinking. Which is why teachers feel that pressure to tick all the boxes to meet the curriculum. A lot of the time students are assessed through their memory of the course content. This does not give the students the chance to express themselves. We know that all students learn differently some will understand and remember the information quicker then others. Students fall behind because of this.

Kodi-Leigh Beattie
4 years ago
Reply to  Jordan

I agree Jordan that as educators we spend way to much time simply ticking boxes and rushing to cover copious amounts of content rather than actually focusing on the most exciting part of our jobs – seeing creativity and high order thinking happening, including those awesome light bulb moments! Wouldn’t it be nice to cut back on some of the content box ticking so that we can actually explore student interest so that we are better able to engage students.

Michelle Pellew
4 years ago

The way we assess. We want students to explore possibilities, present in a way that is suitable to their way of learning. I’ve had students who can recall information verbally displaying depth in knowledge and understanding. Then, it comes HSC time, and most do it as they are made to stay til they are 17 (another sacred cow) and they are made to conform to a written response. Where is the fairness in being able able to display your understanding of content. Also tests that assess one day in a students learning.

Kodi-Leigh Beattie
4 years ago

I agree Michelle that the way in which we asses is become more and more irrelevant. It is very discouraging when you see students who can verbalise and articulate so much, but when it comes to completing exams or writing essays they just can’t express how much they truly know and understand. I always tell students that they are so much more than their results.

Jordan
4 years ago

Yes you can ask a student a question and they will give you the answer and it will be right but get them to write the answer down on paper and they freeze up. I agree HSC time should be a choice not be forced to stay until they are 17.

Jacob
4 years ago

The idea that all people under the age of 17 have to be in a school 6hrs a day, 5 days a week, 41 weeks a year no longer makes sense. There are students who might wish for more time in schools and those for whom school is a prison. It would be nice to shift away from the idea that schools are simply about job preparedness and academic learning towards a view that schools work in tandem with parents to develop flourishing humans.

Jordan
4 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

I agree all students are different some like school and some do not. Other countries are changing how much schooling students need. Is this something we need to do as well?

Richard Clement
4 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

Hi Jacob. I totally agree. I have been privy to a case just as you suggested. A year 11 girl has a huge interest in being a beauty therapist and attends (well used to before COVID-19) TAFE every week. She has no aptitude for school or the schooling environment, so consequently only attended 4 whole days last term, and the other 6 days she attended she was very late to come or skipped out really early. I don’t think that her carer/s had any idea that she was doing this, and could have been up to all kinds of derogatory behaviors.
In my time, year 10 was the only prerequisite

Jade
4 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

I agree Jacob, school is most definitely not for everyone and the fact that students are now required to stay until the age of 17 is outdated. It would be fantastic to see other avenues opened up for these students.

Mark
4 years ago
Reply to  Jade

There are a plethora of functioning/working adults today who left school before year 10 (some even earlier), my father for one. Getting a trade should not be frowned upon or relegated to later in a students life. There are issues about people just dropping off to go on welfare payments but we already semi have a system in place to stop that. We allow students to finish up school if they can show that they are going into employment, I think it just need to be made more a of a clear pathway.

Nicole Richardson
3 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

That’s a great point, Jacob.
Many students would no doubt improve their attitude to learning and increase their ability to focus with less time spent at school and flexible hours of attendance.

Warren Stanley
3 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

A very good point Jacob we need to think what suites our students in the current context not what has been used since last century

Kathy
3 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

Totally agree here. It is even more frustrating that now students have to stay till they are 17. There has be other places for some students where they can be imaginative and creative and not have to perform to standardised tests.

Trent Boyle
3 years ago
Reply to  Jacob

I agree. Requiring students to stay at school until they are 17 regardless of their future aspirations is outdated. I also believe that earlier than this even, students should be given the choice to shift the direction of their education towards a vocation that interests them if they choose.

Rachael
4 years ago

i know this may be controversial but, I think letting students move up grades when they have not achieved a minimal standard is a sacred cow. More students would benefit from repeating a year and moving up a year level should reflect your minimal academic skills level.

Richard
4 years ago
Reply to  Rachael

I totally agree Rachel. The schooling system has seemed to have adopted the practice that “no student is a failure”, and passes them on to the next year with no accountability of their ineffectual efforts or scholastic achievements. How can a student possibly have any learning outcomes if it always seems to be swept under the rug?

Paul Crook
4 years ago
Reply to  Rachael

I agree. We set students up for a fall when they leave as “everybody wins a Trophy” regardless.

Bev Lamotte
4 years ago

The Education Department’s Sacred Cow is not allowing students to leave school until they are 17. There are many students who, for many different reasons, wish to leave school earlier. Students will still continue to learn whilst attending TAFE, apprentiships, part time and full time employment, community programs etc. Why force students to attend school, usually resulting in attendance, truancy and behaviour problems, when other resources are available which meet the student’s needs better.

Michelle Pellew
4 years ago
Reply to  Bev Lamotte

I agree with this. Why are they made to stay when there are other opportunities for learning whether it be educationally,practically or even socially. School is not a fit for everyone.

Kerrie
4 years ago
Reply to  Bev Lamotte

Yes Bev. And so I fought this with my second son. He managed to get himself an awesome apprenticeship and I jumped through hoops to get him out. As he was sponsored by his company, things worked out. He is loving it and thriving now.
2 more years at school would have been such a waste of his time, teachers time and our money!

Glen Bowman
4 years ago

I am convinced that making students stay at school till 17 is heavily flawed. The premise is that education is a good thing (yes) and schools provide education(yes) therefore it is good that all students stay at school (maybe not) . For so many students, they still want to learn but in a different way a lot earlier in their school life, often as early in Year 9, but are forced to plough on through curriculum that struggles to meet their needs.

Rachael
4 years ago
Reply to  Glen Bowman

I agree some students would be better off being in the workforce earlier and returning to education if they choose later in life.

Bev Lamotte
4 years ago
Reply to  Glen Bowman

I can not agree with you more Glen. School is not for everyone, some students that struggled whilst going through the school system, however excelled once they left school and gained employment.

Jacob
4 years ago
Reply to  Glen Bowman

I agree with this Glenn. I’ve always thought that there are people that school is simply not for. Yet we have nowhere else for them to go. Pushing them into the workforce is perhaps also not entirely the right route. An ideal situation could exist where all students don’t spend every day in a classroom but spend some part of their week involved in community projects, work experience, civic duties etc.

Warren Stanley
3 years ago
Reply to  Glen Bowman

The change to 17 was a big mistake it has forced students into a system that really is setting them up to fail if they do not want a HSC

Kathy
3 years ago
Reply to  Glen Bowman

There are a lot of students that school today does not cater for. For those students who like the rigour of academic learning fine. however those other students need to spend some time doing something else. For example volunteering, introduction to work skills etc.

Laura
4 years ago

Assessing students’ memory of content through testing and grouping students according to these results. This is resistant to educational changes such as ‘No student Left Behind’ and the ‘Closing the Gap’ policy. Is it really conducive to place all students with the same struggles in the same group? Should year groups intermingle more in learning spaces, so that younger students have their generational role models learning alongside them and that senior students get to enact more mentor roles? We are not segregated in to age groups as employees and our lives are not partitioned into KLA’s. I think there needs to be a more holistic learning practice. The whole structure we are in is a Sacred Cow!

Jayson Hourn
4 years ago

The notion of year groups is my sacred cow. In a curriculum that is differentiated into stages, I think that classrooms could benefit by accumulating students at the same stage of learning instead of age groups.

Laura
4 years ago
Reply to  Jayson Hourn

Yes, I completely agree. I am a new scheme teacher, but I am teaching alongside people who have been working in the field for over 30 years. I think that school should reflect how integrated our society is in the ‘real world’.

Diana Silcock
4 years ago

I have read comments down about the Assessment Tasks and it seems that we all think they are hard to manage for the kids, to what purpose. I think quite a few kids cannot understand the literacy involved and what purpose is the task? We always have them, so will they be the sacred cow forever and a day? Maybe we have the involvement and participation in class learning is then a measurement of successful learning for the individual student. Maybe that would give them a reason to listen and learn and be involved in a meaningful way. We the teacher, would have to be on the ball because we would really need to engage the kids successfully for our own and their positive outcome.

Andrew Collins
4 years ago
Reply to  Diana Silcock

I agree, relevant educational directorates would be maintaining the current set up for the foreseeable future I would expect. There have been adjustments to assessment quantity, though this then translates to larger and perhaps more demanding tasks. As teachers and schools we are going to be required to be innovative and ground breaking with the processes we use to provide us with the necessary information about what students do or do not know. Formative assessment is a new direction beginning to gain more momentum.

Jayson Hourn
4 years ago
Reply to  Diana Silcock

Literacy is certainly a common road block for students to achieve and present their understanding of the concepts and content that we deliver to them.

Laura
4 years ago
Reply to  Diana Silcock

yes, good point Diana. We should be looking for learning attitudes not necessarily exhibitions of what was taught, i.e, projects, tests and assessment tasks. Then students may realise what skills are needed in the world post-school.

Bev Lamotte
4 years ago
Reply to  Diana Silcock

I agree, traditional means of assessment needs to be changed. Every student should have the opportunity to demonstrate what they know.

Andrew Collins
4 years ago

There are elements of the curriculum which make sense and obviously have their place. However, at some point in time, they have now become documents which at their very existence cause staff to break out into cold sweats. Most syllabuses have recently undergone an overhaul and subsequent re programming and we were all discussing the enormity of such changes. Why have we not kept what we knew worked, and instead provided staff with the knowledge, understandings and skills to up-skill their teaching repertoire.
I’d also like to say that the now entrenched tradition of students being required to stay at school up to the age of 17 (though with some loop holes). This change came about for whatever political reason at the time and to be honest, given some school’s communities and contexts, this simply does not work and sets students up for failure (Great school’s have had to develop their own solutions and processes to the problem). I wonder what the realities would be if we were to explore a different solution to school leaving?

Carol stapley
4 years ago

I think the content and pressure to complete assessment within a certain time frame can be quite constraining, it doesn’t allow the opportunity to explore ideas and questions that learners Would really like to unfortunately.

Rachael
4 years ago
Reply to  Carol stapley

Also they expect us to cover far too much content.

Paul Crook
4 years ago
Reply to  Carol stapley

I have heard this numerous times.Teaching a student to think outside the square is really important .Constraints due to content impact this.

benn saunders
4 years ago

The context of formalised Assessment tasks directing the way we teach and also the focus on what students need to learn is not productive for teachers or students. I believe that this places the emphasis on what the student can recall or already knows opposed to what the student has actually learnt or how much effort has been applied. Consequently, the students that perform poorly due to whatever the reason may be (poor memory, poor performance under pressure etc.) will generally disengage whilst the students that perform well are praised and thrive under circumstances that are challenging and extremely stressful for others; not really a fair assessment.
In the modern day world, skill sets required to succeed have changed significantly yet our method of assessment and the perceived areas of what students need to succeed in to be successful have not evolved at the same rate.

Michelle Pellew
4 years ago
Reply to  benn saunders

Completely agree. It is not a fair indication of what a student can truly achieve – more of a display that they can fulfil particular requested requirements and tick boxes.

Chris Collier
4 years ago
Reply to  benn saunders

I agree Benn. We are now coming to realise and acknowledge that all students are unique in their learning methods and can excel in multiple areas, so to continue to assess strictly on a students ability to recall information will need to change.

ian reynolds
4 years ago

The biggest hurdles are teaching and then setting inappropriate assessment tasks. How can we set an assessment that requires a definitive answer when we want students to think for themselves, and provide an opinion supported by evidence that they have gathered.

Jayson Hourn
4 years ago
Reply to  ian reynolds

Good one, trying to pigeonhole responses and answers when there is a variety of interpretations is restrictive.

Rae
3 years ago
Reply to  ian reynolds

It is indeed quite challenging to set appropriate assessment tasks that evaluate students creative thinking. But then again, it depends on the assessment task- pen and paper? Very challenging to demonstrate creativity. Whereas tasks where students construct/ complete group tasks etc, do provide greater opportunity to do so.

brianna.honess
4 years ago

Assessment time frames are not conducive to driving educational transformation. If, as should be the case, we are placing importance on transfer knowledge, visible learning, involving students and making learning tangible, we need to redesign outdated assessment requirements.

noelene
4 years ago

I see that following the curriculum just does not fit how pupils should learn.The description of the curriculum we are to follow often doesn’t make sense ,so we do set work/activities just to tick the so call boxes.Learning needs to be more practical with activities to teach LLN skills that pupils can relate to,in their everyday life.Testing of knowledge by written work is often not taken seriously by students as most say they don’t really care and don’t make an effort.But are assessments the only way to grade??

Diana Silcock
4 years ago
Reply to  noelene

Your question Noelene, “Are assessments the only way to grade”? I think no to that. Another way to assessment is to give a grade for participation and involvement in the class activity. This would give the kids a way of getting a positive, good grade, feel that it’s achievable and possibly and hopefully enjoyable learning!!! This method will give us more enjoyable learning time with the class and hopefully more involvement as a way to learn whatever you are teaching.

Tim Hunt
4 years ago

Content and assessment time frames are too narrow. Nowhere near enough time for students to get a deeper understanding of concepts. Tick that box, move onto the next box, irrespective of the students understanding or not. This is how students fall behind.

brianna.honess
4 years ago
Reply to  Tim Hunt

Yes exactly Tim. Restructuring assessment time frames to allow for the benefits of the ‘re-thinking’ and change is needed

Diana Silcock
4 years ago
Reply to  brianna.honess

A big yes from me as well! This topic of assessing the kids could be a great change from us all and get rid of the sacred cow to allow more actual enjoyment in learning!

ian reynolds
4 years ago
Reply to  Tim Hunt

Could not agree more. Assessment time frames set to accommodate reporting schedules. Every time there is interruption the learning time is impacted but the assessment time frame does not change.

Glen Bowman
4 years ago
Reply to  Tim Hunt

This sounds like a common thread Tim.

Christine Kirby
4 years ago

Providing work with very minimal to no literacy building skills, but expecting the students to just know the metalanguage of the subject.
We need to teach the art of language in each subject and allow the students to develop a solid understanding before we use this within our subjects.

noelene
4 years ago

Hi I agree with this ,and the simple grasp of the English language is often lost as students don’t have great reading/understanding/comprehension skills.

brianna.honess
4 years ago

oh yes, the “art of language in each subject”, essential. This requires more TIME than is generally available.

Rae
3 years ago

The one thing that all teachers together wish they had more of- TIME!! Teaching metalanguage of a subject is very important, however greater challenge is finding the time to be able to do so.

Toby Gollan
4 years ago

The system of teaching for assessment rather than deeper knowledge and meta-cognition is now feeling very out dated. Students no longer fit this mode of education and neither does the changing nature of jobs. The need to meet expected outcomes and in a certain time frame is a significant hurdle. There are layers of reasons why students are struggling to express themselves but allowing time and deeper investigations would certainly be a starting point in schools.

Christine Kirby
4 years ago
Reply to  Toby Gollan

Very interesting point – I definitely agree with you.

benn saunders
4 years ago
Reply to  Toby Gollan

Well said Toby! The demands we face as teachers are without doubt becoming more challenging and I guess the big question is, how well are we preparing our students for after school when so much of our time needs to be allocated towards meeting these demands.

Jay Harris
4 years ago

Two big things I have found is “Teaching and Assessment”
Teaching: Time plays a huge role as we need to “tick” the boxes in terms of the curriculum which leaves minimal time for students to explore critical thinking and creativity. Traditional means of assessment also tends to limit students ability to express themselves and relies alot of the time on simply recalling or remembering information.

Toby Gollan
4 years ago
Reply to  Jay Harris

I couldn’t agree more. It is restricting opportunities for original thought.

ian reynolds
4 years ago
Reply to  Jay Harris

Totally agree, the learning experience is taking a back set to the required assessment

benn saunders
4 years ago
Reply to  Jay Harris

I completely agree with you Jay. A sacred cow is definitely assessment tasks tendency to be dependent on the students ability to simply remember information. The issue with this is that not all students have a good memory whilst others may succeed in this area which is not a fair assessment.

Andrew Collins
4 years ago
Reply to  Jay Harris

Agreed, though I believe this would be more of an issue for stage 6 students. Why can’t we stretch the boundaries a little in stage’s 4 and 5 with some flexibility around what outcomes are covered/assessed etc. While I am aware NESA has put out statements in regards to the current COVID-19 situation, this is the first time I have seen anything like this. I have also heard (on the quiet) that NESA are not overly concerned with stage 4/5 outcomes etc, they are not their big priority.

Jade
4 years ago
Reply to  Jay Harris

Totally agree Jay, we really need to rethink our modes of assessment to best suit the needs of our students as well as the capabilities we want them to build.

Rohan Abbott
4 years ago

The extent of the curriculum and the need to cover content results in superficial learning and a lack of ability to analyse and understand greater concepts. Schools are very structured by nature so to develop creative teaching methods or learning experiences outside of the confounds of the school grounds can sometimes be a logistical nightmare. Often easier to follow the path of less resistance.

Jay Harris
4 years ago
Reply to  Rohan Abbott

Agree! The time factor and extent of the curriculum plays a huge factor in students ability to develop a deeper understanding of concepts and also to be able to apply critical thinking and creativity to activities.

Toby Gollan
4 years ago
Reply to  Rohan Abbott

100% Rohan – the focus on providing layers of evidence of student learning and simply covering required content in a restricted time is binding. Even when new opportunities and ideas for learning are implemented it seems the paper work and justification of these measures take more time than the actual teaching and therefore the benefits to the students.

Jenny Umbers
4 years ago

The way students are assessed. The content we have to teach, little room for depth of understanding. The inability to integrate students across age groups with similar interests. there are lots of archaic practices that need a rethink. All well and good for us to make teaching-changes where possible but we are limited by the system and curricula.

Jay Harris
4 years ago
Reply to  Jenny Umbers

Agree with your point that we are very limited by the system and curricula. I believe that we as teachers need to continually adapt and alter our teaching and learning practices to help cater for all students however we are still limited by the confines of the system.

Christine Kirby
4 years ago
Reply to  Jenny Umbers

This is a perfect link to the first reason why change is hard to implement – reflex of resistance. And I personally think this resistance comes from everyone, including members within our team.

Jacob
4 years ago
Reply to  Jenny Umbers

It’s increasingly rare to see just one person judging the quality of a task. The success of an idea, an app, a piece of writing, a blog, a YouTube video, is determined by the creator’s peers. But in a classroom the outcome of a student’s learning is often filtered through one person. There is a place for this but in many instances valid peer assessment or collaborative assessment would be much more appropriate.

Zoe-Lee Fuller
4 years ago

– Having students all complete the exact same assessment, rather than skills based (ie. assessing the skill, not the content)
– Assessments that rely on recall of information, rather than analysis, creative/critical thinking, evaluation, etc.
– Standardised testing and ‘teaching to the test’ (which we’re not supposed to do but we all know happens regardless)
– Having students copy copious notes from the board – a waste of time when they have the same information at their fingertips (phones)
– Lumping students together by age, rather than ability and aptitude
– Placing too much emphasis on scores/grades from exams and other summative assessment, rather than the formative assessment and participation/effort/attitude
– Allowing students to progress to the next year/stage level when they have not passed the material from their current stage (god forbid we tell them that they haven’t worked hard enough to pass a year of their schooling, thank you, age of self esteem)
– Giving teachers too many classes – how are we to get to know and form authentic rapport with students that allows us to tap into their individual interests and abilities if we have more than 150 students to get to know?
– Rollcall – a waste of time when the roll is marked in each subsequent lesson
– Compliance paperwork – how are teachers meant to find the time to create meaningful, engaging learning experiences when we have so much administrative paperwork?

Jenny Umbers
4 years ago
Reply to  Zoe-Lee Fuller

I agree. Each student deserves to be assessed fairly, they are not no matter how we try. The emphasis should be on the learning and where students go with the knowledge they gain not on what they can remember and regurgitate for common tests.

Rohan Abbott
4 years ago
Reply to  Jenny Umbers

Agreed, often difficult to find the time to consider other teaching alternatives with so many classes/students and documenting of everything we do.

Tim Hunt
4 years ago
Reply to  Zoe-Lee Fuller

Couldn’t agree more. Splitting classes between too many teachers is a major problem. Might see a class once a fortnight, very difficult to remember all their names let alone develop some sort of rapport with them.

noelene
4 years ago
Reply to  Zoe-Lee Fuller

Yes I agree with your statement.Hard to maintain interest if you are only copying notes or classes see you as that teacher they have once a fortnight,and your teacher is not sure what you are up to.

Jess
3 years ago
Reply to  Zoe-Lee Fuller

Absolutely agree re. assessment! It is so problematic when you think about the actual purpose of it. Measuring student growth is important but how can it be achieved in a way that accounts for what is truly important rather than the narrow field we currently have?

Jess
4 years ago

The structure of our curriculum and the ultimate purpose of our schooling, higher education included. The way that we assess our students within subjects. We do have to assess against a set of outcomes but the number and type of assessments throughout the school year for 7-10? Having one unit of work per term culminating in a task seems to negate room for movement towards more collaborative, project based activities?

Zoe-Lee Fuller
4 years ago
Reply to  Jess

The structure of our curriculum, certainly. It is so overcrowded, particularly the English syllabus, that there is no wiggle room for creativity, student interest etc.

Jenny Umbers
4 years ago
Reply to  Jess

I agree. We cannot prepare students for future jobs using outdated content and methods. There needs to be room of innovation and invention within the education system.

Rohan Abbott
4 years ago
Reply to  Jess

Assessment practices should be regularly evaluated and reflected upon within faculties and across faculties as well. Not only the types of tasks presented to students but what impact that has on the class progress/content and teacher workload.

Kerry-lea
4 years ago

I believe we need to change the way we structure our learning environments and teaching curriculum structures as they are outdated and not fit for purpose for our changing times. They need to change to allow for adaptability. If we are going to help fit students adequately for the future our methods/structures must change. (This needs to start at the top and filter down)
In our current climate of Covid 19 lockdown, it has been exciting to witness changes in the delivery of education. This has been possible because everyone is committed to helping and offering solutions and this gives hope that in future, it will be possible to make changes that will improve student outcomes. Hopefully we can learn the important lessons from this experience as it has demonstrated what can be achieved with cooperation and willingness.

Jess
4 years ago
Reply to  Kerry-lea

Agreed! The innovation and commitment in adjusting to environmental needs from all levels in this current climate is amazing. I do wonder what education will look like after Covid19? It is the perfect time to make structural and practical changes and I hope that willingness and cooperation continues .

Zoe-Lee Fuller
4 years ago
Reply to  Jess

Also agree! The way we deliver education is already changing so fast with the advent of Covid-19. Teachers have banded together to achieve remarkable odds. Imagine what else we are capable of!

Tim Hunt
4 years ago
Reply to  Kerry-lea

Yes but the politicians no better than we do. You can see it in the media on a daily basis. One day teachers are the best, next day we’re resisting the govt. I think that it needs to change from the bottom up. Teachers know what the reality of being in a school is. We’re the ones on the front line. Politicians are only interested in the external groups that contribute the most via party donations or self interest groups.

Glen Bowman
4 years ago
Reply to  Kerry-lea

I really agree with this, but Education is always bandied about, often by people with very limited knowledge of what really happens. Very frustrating.

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